Since moving here I have not actually found the lack of garbage cans to be much of a problem in day to day life, but when I was a tourist it did feel inconvenient since I wasn’t used to it (and as a tourist, you don’t have the structure in your life wherein you would naturally have access to trash cans throughout the day, like at a workplace).
From the perspective of taking care of public spaces, I absolutely agree that it is a great cultural attitude. People are ingrained from youth to understand that other people are cleaning the spaces you exist in, they are not lesser for doing those jobs, and it’s a core cultural belief that you shouldn’t inconvenience others even if you don’t know them; this attitude makes public spaces feel very pleasant and contributes to the cleanliness and safety that most who visit Japan come to admire.
That said I don’t think that Japan is exempt from foisting their garbage onto third world countries as was posited in the article. Once it’s in the trash system you’re just as equally not taking responsibility for the waste you generate. While the public spaces are clean, Japan is also renowned for using a lot of unnecessary single use plastics, and people don’t really take responsibility for that.
As a tourist, I didn't realize what a commitment I was making when I bought a snack from a vending machine one morning. I had to carry around the empty wrapper until I got back to my hotel room that night.
That said the inverse problem in the USA is that there are practically no public toilets and if you find one it’s probably disgusting. I find that a much bigger inconvenience than needing to carry some garbage around!
Interestingly they have similar dynamics: due to the scarcity of that public resource, the cost of providing it becomes very high, which causes it to become more scarce. In the US, a business providing a public washroom has to deal with very heavy usage, because of how rare they are, which makes maintenance expensive. They become the bathroom for the whole neighborhood. In Japan, businesses can offer clean high quality washrooms at little cost because there are many others sharing the load. But a convenience store offering a garbage bin in a popular area will quickly find it overloaded.
This creates a feedback loop where scarcity drives further scarcity.
No, the author (who's also the one who posted this to HN) thinks it is a burden, but it's one you voluntarily agreed to by purchasing and consuming the item whose remains are now garbage.
The irony is that products in Japan come with so much garbage. Small items come packed in thick, crinkly plastic that doesn’t hold any form once it has been emptied of its product. Bento boxes are several times thicker than the packaging for ready-to-eat meals in other countries, and they don’t compress at all. When I’m touristing, I rely on the ability to shed load and make space for other things so I don’t have to go back to the hotel.
The fact that Japan still has so much single use plastic is really puzzling especially since it has a relatively small landmass so no much room for landfills.
Exactly this. They just burn pretty much everything. I have no idea what the carbon capture situation is like in Japan. But at least they use the waste heat to power municipal baths.
Weird, interacting with Japan mostly only through video games (and only a limited amount with food) I actually find them almost the opposite most of the time.
Import games arrive in tiny boxes with almost no packaging and manuals that have been design like origami inserts to take up only the tiny remaining space available.
I wouldn’t consider eating Japanese food or playing Japanese video games to constitute “interacting with Japan” at all. At best, you are interacting with its cultural exports.
Aside from the point made by author - I visited Japan last year, I never had too much of an issue with garbage when visiting the major cities.
Most garbage was compactible and clean enough that I could stuff it into my garbage pocket (to the dismay of my girlfriend). Larger or dirtier items, I would put into a ziplock bag in my backpack that I carried with me everywhere. Public trash receptacles, while rarer than in North America, could be found often enough if you were observant of your surroundings.
"The modern condition consists of a constant self-infantilization, of any number of “non-adulting” activities. The main being, of course, plugging into a dopamine casino right before going to sleep and right upon waking up. At least a morning cigarette habit in 1976 gave one time to look at the world in front of one’s eyes (and a gentle nicotine buzz). Other non-adulting activities include relinquishment of general attention, concentration, and critical thinking capabilities. The desire for deus ex machina style political intercession that belies the complexities of real-world systems. Easy answers, easy solutions to problems of unfathomable scale. Scientific retardation because it “feels” good. Deliverance — deliverance! — now, with as little effort as possible."
Its amazing how different the culture is. I don't even think twice about carrying garbage on me, but when I recommend Americans to just carry their garbage until they can toss it, I might as well have insulted their mother.
Apparently the view is that if society wanted them to keep the earth clean, they would have set out more garbage cans.
Ehh. Unless you're eating a melted candy bar, you probably accumulate more dirt and sweat going through your day than whatever few crumbs leak into your pockets.
You eat some interesting things on the go. Even then, chocolate is the only thing I worry about on that list. Thoroughly eat the sauces and I'm not worried about those packets or a banana peel in my pocket. I'm not manually washing my clothes anyway.
Mayonnaise isn’t exactly an exotic ingredient. In fact, Kewpie mayonnaise is something of a Japanese cultural icon. You would expect to find it on or inside of sandwiches and other foods typically taken to go.
Bananas are a fantastic on the go snack because they are self-portioned and give you plenty of sugar that your body can readily metabolize for continuing to walk around the city.
It's not that it's exotic. I just figure If I'm carrying sauce packets they are either sealed or opened and used. I'm not worried about any empty packets messing up my pockets significantly.
They don't put their trash in the streets except for garbage pickup day. That's not related to the removal of public garbage cans (which, yes, was a reaction to the sarin gas attacks). It's more of a substitute for dumpsters.
I especially appreciated the connection of the personal responsibility for one's waste to "adulting" in general. (you know it's problematic when a word had to be invented for not remaining a perpetual petulant child, which is assumed to be the default behaviour)
Another aspect that really follows immediately for accepting one's garbage responsibility: maybe don't buy all that shit from corporate vendors in the first place?
That's another Japanese tradition: pack your own lunch in a reusable container.
Of course, that's also not a part of the internet brain damaged era...
It's less of an issue when you live there versus when you just visit, however when you live there you have to learn how to get on the right side of your local garbage do gooder. They will judge your garbage separating ability and they will make it known if they have to adapt your work. There is one in every block, and if you haven't bumped into them then you are doing well. Sometimes they don't even live in your block, sometimes they commute to your building to judge what you left on the kerb.
It's more than that. Kids are expected to clean their schools, even the bathrooms. Not surprisingly, this nurtures an attitude of not messing it up in the first place.
That’s only true specifically in nightlife districts in the most central parts of Tokyo, once you get drunk enough all social convention goes out the window
Since moving here I have not actually found the lack of garbage cans to be much of a problem in day to day life, but when I was a tourist it did feel inconvenient since I wasn’t used to it (and as a tourist, you don’t have the structure in your life wherein you would naturally have access to trash cans throughout the day, like at a workplace).
From the perspective of taking care of public spaces, I absolutely agree that it is a great cultural attitude. People are ingrained from youth to understand that other people are cleaning the spaces you exist in, they are not lesser for doing those jobs, and it’s a core cultural belief that you shouldn’t inconvenience others even if you don’t know them; this attitude makes public spaces feel very pleasant and contributes to the cleanliness and safety that most who visit Japan come to admire.
That said I don’t think that Japan is exempt from foisting their garbage onto third world countries as was posited in the article. Once it’s in the trash system you’re just as equally not taking responsibility for the waste you generate. While the public spaces are clean, Japan is also renowned for using a lot of unnecessary single use plastics, and people don’t really take responsibility for that.
As a tourist, I didn't realize what a commitment I was making when I bought a snack from a vending machine one morning. I had to carry around the empty wrapper until I got back to my hotel room that night.
Trick: there is almost always a garbage can next to a vending machine, and there are many vending machines in Japan.
Caveat: some of those garbage cans are for can recycling only. But there is often another one for garbage like food wrappers.
In my recent experience it's very rare to find anything other than recycling bins next to vending machines in Japan.
Buying a snack really is a big commitment, which is unfortunate because of how tasty they are.
That said the inverse problem in the USA is that there are practically no public toilets and if you find one it’s probably disgusting. I find that a much bigger inconvenience than needing to carry some garbage around!
I fully agree.
Interestingly they have similar dynamics: due to the scarcity of that public resource, the cost of providing it becomes very high, which causes it to become more scarce. In the US, a business providing a public washroom has to deal with very heavy usage, because of how rare they are, which makes maintenance expensive. They become the bathroom for the whole neighborhood. In Japan, businesses can offer clean high quality washrooms at little cost because there are many others sharing the load. But a convenience store offering a garbage bin in a popular area will quickly find it overloaded.
This creates a feedback loop where scarcity drives further scarcity.
The author of the linked article thinks you are simply wrong for considering this a burden.
No, the author (who's also the one who posted this to HN) thinks it is a burden, but it's one you voluntarily agreed to by purchasing and consuming the item whose remains are now garbage.
The irony is that products in Japan come with so much garbage. Small items come packed in thick, crinkly plastic that doesn’t hold any form once it has been emptied of its product. Bento boxes are several times thicker than the packaging for ready-to-eat meals in other countries, and they don’t compress at all. When I’m touristing, I rely on the ability to shed load and make space for other things so I don’t have to go back to the hotel.
The fact that Japan still has so much single use plastic is really puzzling especially since it has a relatively small landmass so no much room for landfills.
They burn it :-)
On this note, the exterior of an incinerator in Osaka was 'refurbished' by the Austrian artist Huntertwasser, who was certainly an interesting person.
https://hundertwasser.com/en/architecture/arch122_mop_maishi...
If you're ever in Vienna, there is a museum of his design that is worth visiting - it's quite unlike anything I've visited before/since
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hundertwasserhaus
Exactly this. They just burn pretty much everything. I have no idea what the carbon capture situation is like in Japan. But at least they use the waste heat to power municipal baths.
Interesting. And how do they handle the toxic fumes?
That is an active area of research.
They breath then, that's how...
Weird, interacting with Japan mostly only through video games (and only a limited amount with food) I actually find them almost the opposite most of the time.
Import games arrive in tiny boxes with almost no packaging and manuals that have been design like origami inserts to take up only the tiny remaining space available.
I wouldn’t consider eating Japanese food or playing Japanese video games to constitute “interacting with Japan” at all. At best, you are interacting with its cultural exports.
Aside from the point made by author - I visited Japan last year, I never had too much of an issue with garbage when visiting the major cities.
Most garbage was compactible and clean enough that I could stuff it into my garbage pocket (to the dismay of my girlfriend). Larger or dirtier items, I would put into a ziplock bag in my backpack that I carried with me everywhere. Public trash receptacles, while rarer than in North America, could be found often enough if you were observant of your surroundings.
This tangential paragraph is gold:
"The modern condition consists of a constant self-infantilization, of any number of “non-adulting” activities. The main being, of course, plugging into a dopamine casino right before going to sleep and right upon waking up. At least a morning cigarette habit in 1976 gave one time to look at the world in front of one’s eyes (and a gentle nicotine buzz). Other non-adulting activities include relinquishment of general attention, concentration, and critical thinking capabilities. The desire for deus ex machina style political intercession that belies the complexities of real-world systems. Easy answers, easy solutions to problems of unfathomable scale. Scientific retardation because it “feels” good. Deliverance — deliverance! — now, with as little effort as possible."
Its amazing how different the culture is. I don't even think twice about carrying garbage on me, but when I recommend Americans to just carry their garbage until they can toss it, I might as well have insulted their mother.
Apparently the view is that if society wanted them to keep the earth clean, they would have set out more garbage cans.
The interior of food packaging is often soiled by the food it previously contained. I don’t want to transfer that soil to my pocket or my backpack.
Ehh. Unless you're eating a melted candy bar, you probably accumulate more dirt and sweat going through your day than whatever few crumbs leak into your pockets.
Japanese ice cream bars are really good though. As are mitarashi dango. It's a tough choice. You basically have to carry a sealable bag with you.
Dirt is way easier to clean than mayonnaise, chocolate, bananas, or anything with a red sauce.
You eat some interesting things on the go. Even then, chocolate is the only thing I worry about on that list. Thoroughly eat the sauces and I'm not worried about those packets or a banana peel in my pocket. I'm not manually washing my clothes anyway.
Mayonnaise isn’t exactly an exotic ingredient. In fact, Kewpie mayonnaise is something of a Japanese cultural icon. You would expect to find it on or inside of sandwiches and other foods typically taken to go.
Bananas are a fantastic on the go snack because they are self-portioned and give you plenty of sugar that your body can readily metabolize for continuing to walk around the city.
And of course, chocolate is delicious.
It's not that it's exotic. I just figure If I'm carrying sauce packets they are either sealed or opened and used. I'm not worried about any empty packets messing up my pockets significantly.
It's not a culture thing. They had trash cans. Until the sarin attacks.
Now people in Japan just put their trash in the streets. It piles up and early in the morning everything is cleaned.
They don't put their trash in the streets except for garbage pickup day. That's not related to the removal of public garbage cans (which, yes, was a reaction to the sarin gas attacks). It's more of a substitute for dumpsters.
[dead]
Excellent article!
I especially appreciated the connection of the personal responsibility for one's waste to "adulting" in general. (you know it's problematic when a word had to be invented for not remaining a perpetual petulant child, which is assumed to be the default behaviour)
Another aspect that really follows immediately for accepting one's garbage responsibility: maybe don't buy all that shit from corporate vendors in the first place?
That's another Japanese tradition: pack your own lunch in a reusable container.
Of course, that's also not a part of the internet brain damaged era...
It's less of an issue when you live there versus when you just visit, however when you live there you have to learn how to get on the right side of your local garbage do gooder. They will judge your garbage separating ability and they will make it known if they have to adapt your work. There is one in every block, and if you haven't bumped into them then you are doing well. Sometimes they don't even live in your block, sometimes they commute to your building to judge what you left on the kerb.
[dead]
TL;DR: Japan doesn't have ubiquitous public garbage cans - you are expected to take your garbage with you until get home.
It's more than that. Kids are expected to clean their schools, even the bathrooms. Not surprisingly, this nurtures an attitude of not messing it up in the first place.
Tokyo is trashed before it's cleaned in the morning.
Ever go out at 3am? Rats and trash everywhere.
Squeaky clean by morning though, their cleaners are amazing.
Lack of trash cans is because of sarin attacks, nothing else.
So they just put the trash in the street.
That’s only true specifically in nightlife districts in the most central parts of Tokyo, once you get drunk enough all social convention goes out the window